Marine updates

[Yeltz27]

Raiden that's an excellent post. JB, I get your point about the pitch, but is it just being used as an excuse at the moment? Not by you of course, but surely somebody else could produce better than what we've seen on it because other teams do when they play at the Grove.

I find the silence from the other side of the argument interesting. KenR asked for a response last week and never got one. It adds to the sense that our viewpoints don't count or matter

[drummyb]

Fair point 27. However equally, when we had the unbeaten run, the naysayers were equally absent and there were no John Hill out posts in sight, no moaning and no squabbling. Equally Tony Pulis was the worst thing ever a few months ago, now irs all 6th in the league and everyones happy. No one enjoys losing. Ill give Raiden his due cos he posts win or lose.

I find the whole saga depressing tbh, results and the bickering on here. The old Yeltz/new Yeltz stuff is quite frankly pathetic. Im oooold Yeltz and more recently born again.

I do think we have the potential to be better than we are. But so do the fans of every team. I also think JH is doing his best but sometimes it doesnt work. Clearly a lot of people rate him or he wouldnt be doing what he does. But football is results driven. Should we continue being beaten then the end result is inevitable. I know of no club owner ever who accepted loss after loss.

I reiterate a point I made weeks ago. We are lower to mid table level. It is the budgets fault which in turn is the managers fault.

[Yeltz27]

Yes Drummy but there is a difference. As you know I've been firmly Hill Out for the best part of three years. If you are Hill in and paying to go and watch, you won't be anywhere near as frustrated by what is going on as if like me, you feel like you've put up with this for too long and have had enough. Yet we still pay to go even though we are basically told 'your feelings don't count' because John Hill is staying regardless. I said earlier in the season, there's not much point me posting after a win cos I've had enough regardless now, cos the cycle will always repeats itself and we will be back to having to watch this.

So yes, KenR is right that somebody should have responded. Why is there no pressure on the manager? How can you have so many unhappy people and never do anything? You can bury your head in the sand and pretend it's a few, but if the Yeltz Family stepped outside the bubble and actually listened and looked, you will find a majority are now unhappy. We will all have views as to why there is a divide and who is responsible, whether that be my strong views or something else. I have my own opinion on why it is there etc. But the owner or somebody needs to say something because if they don't, people will stop going and you will be left with the Yeltz Family and a few others attending on a Saturday. John Hill with his tweet yesterday will have lost an awful lot of support he had and quite rightly should do

[RaidenYeltz]

27, I'd hope there is is pressure on John - from him self, mainly.

I've made my feelings clear. I hope I'm proven wrong - as that will ultimately mean we've been successful.

[wednesburystokie]

Yes Drummy but there is a difference. As you know I've been firmly Hill Out for the best part of three years. If you are Hill in and paying to go and watch, you won't be anywhere near as frustrated by what is going on as if like me, you feel like you've put up with this for too long and have had enough. Yet we still pay to go even though we are basically told 'your feelings don't count' because John Hill is staying regardless. I said earlier in the season, there's not much point me posting after a win cos I've had enough regardless now, cos the cycle will always repeats itself and we will be back to having to watch this.

So yes, KenR is right that somebody should have responded. Why is there no pressure on the manager? How can you have so many unhappy people and never do anything? You can bury your head in the sand and pretend it's a few, but if the Yeltz Family stepped outside the bubble and actually listened and looked, you will find a majority are now unhappy. We will all have views as to why there is a divide and who is responsible, whether that be my strong views or something else. I have my own opinion on why it is there etc. But the owner or somebody needs to say something because if they don't, people will stop going and you will be left with the Yeltz Family and a few others attending on a Saturday. John Hill with his tweet yesterday will have lost an awful lot of support he had and quite rightly should do

I've said it quite a few times but seems to fall onto deaf ears, this is an unofficial fans forum, if people want a response then approach the club in the official way, the website contains everyones email address and you'll always get a reply.

I tend only to post on here when people ask me to now, ie, info from Sheila, the odd match off, the odd match on.

[longballman]

first time poster here. I cant claim to be a great fan. i have been to about 15 matches in last 4 seasons, all at home except for an away Number 9 derby. However, as I was in Liverpool this weekend visiting my daughter I took the 8 mile train ride up to Marine to see the game.

I am interested in the John Hill debate. From the time I first saw us play under him, either Sutton or Tipton in the cup c. 2013, I have had him down as a long ball merchant. As my user name indicates that isn't necessarily a bad thing in my view but it does have limitations and if you are going to do it you need to do it properly. In that season Christie was a brilliant target man and i don't think he has ever been replaced. Saturday was a case in point. Nothing stuck at all. Bowerman looked particularly lightweight and was repeatedly shoved off the ball. Kaiman tries to get at the last man and facing goal but there was just no service at all.

We also looked really weak on the flanks. Defensively an out of position Bragoli was all at sea at right back, even treading on the ball and stumbling more than once; I reckon he had the wrong studs on. I really like both Hancocks and Chilton as they are footballers rather than the more hoof tendencies of Griffiths but once Griff went off we were pretty much non-existent on the left.

It was interesting seeing them play away. My conclusion is we need to go 451 away. Stick Bragoli just in front of the back four and play Haynes/whoever at right back. That would allow Denny and Birley to give a bit more support to the wide men. The funny thing is they did actually try and play football. At one stage Halesowen strung 10 passes together and i have never seen a John Hill side do that! The two Halesowen women supporters standing next to me reacted with derision - 'get it forward' lol. In some ways we were too lightweight and i reckon we are getting caught between two stools - by instinct i think Hill is a long ball man. He is slowly changing to play more football and its not really working. Number one priority is to buy a proper Number 9.

Curzon Ashton were on the telly yesterday. i remember seeing us beat them in the Peter Swales Shield thing in 2013/14. We thrashed them. Ben 10, Christie etc and Tommy Tonks' long throws. But I thought then CA looked a much better footballing side. Their subsequent promotion and first 78 minutes yesterday seems to show this.

The club needs to decide what it wants to do. Do enough to stay up through endeavour, team spirit and launching it? try and change style on hope of going up but accept it might go tits up? The problem is if you replace Hill with a 'passing game' manager then you dont have the players there who can play it.

[piearce9]

first time poster here.

Oof- what a great post. My plans to wade in to this debate can wait a bit, as I think you've nailed a great argument.

[Yeltz27]

Hi longballman, good post. I see your final point about a manager working with players that don't suit his style, but the process has to start somewhere otherwise nothing will ever change. Players move around regularly at this level so it shouldn't be that big a problem in the long term. It might cause a slight problem in the short term, but like you say with Curzon Ashton, it would be worth it in the long run. Get a good manager and everything else eventually gets sorted